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Ron Brown · Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 2:54 am Post subject: .358 Winchester for LR308/AR10?

I am considering building a .358 Winchester upper to put on my spare LR308 lower.

I have not found what I consider a reasonably priced upper or even a barrel to fit an upper. I may have to purchase, profile, port, thread and chamber a barrel.

Although I have never threaded and chambered a barrel, I don't see how it could be that difficult. I plan on building an ~18" barrel. I figure if I start with 21-22" of barrel, I can make a few mistakes before I need an SBR stamp.

I've always liked the .358. I built a light weight Remington 600 bolt gun several years ago with a 20" barrel. It is a real Bambi slammer and does great work on smaller stuff with pistol bullets and RedDot. All in all, just a fun, not too expensive to shoot gun.

I don't know if an AR platform would run with pistol bullets. I guess if I build one, I can find out.

Anyone know where to find a reasonably priced AR barrel in .358?

Ron
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David K · Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 4:30 am Post subject:

there are some manufacturers that make the 358, however not common among the AR enthusiasts. Not sure how the chamber is set compared to the barrel extension, so there are a couple of things, a bolt the right sized for the 358, maybe you know what the cartridge is similar to, i'm not that familiar with it, and a barrel extension appropriately sized for the bolt...

If the bolt is a standard sized used by other current cartridges built on the AR10 platform, than that is easy, well kind of easy, there is always the bolt recess to be considered, which would change how the cartridge is headspaced...

Another thing to think about is how much gas pressure there is, and how it will work with a range of bullets. So there is the gas port length, i.e. pistol, carbine, mid-length, intermediate or rifle length and then the size of the hole for the gas port....

may be best to post on arfcom and see what others say

Burt · Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 11:17 am Post subject:

.358 Winchester is the .308 necked up, so bolt size is not an issue.
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David K · Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 3:13 pm Post subject:

thats good, makes it easier

David K · Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 3:27 pm Post subject:

some things i found online:

"I have a DPMS 18 inch .338 F barrel and it does just fine with that tube. IIRC I am getting over 2400 fps with 185 gr. TTSX bullets and accuracy is good too, coming in at about 1.5 MOA but I have not done a lot of work turning it yet.
If you want a .358 Winchester barrel for the AR10, buy a blank, barrel extension, and maybe reamer and .308 headspace gauges (same for the 243 Win, 260 Rem, 7MM-08, 308 Match, 338 Federal, 358 Win) and have Paladin Machine Service (803-475-7542) make you a barrel. It will cost you no more than $500 total, or about what a Noveske barrel sells for. You can also rent reamers and headspace gauges from 4d Reamer Rentals However, check with Thomas at Paladin because he may have the reamer already and I can almost promise you he has the headspace gauge already.
By the way, the .358 Win in the AR-10/LR-308 platform has been done and it works just fine"

some interesting reading:

http://www.chuckhawks.com/358Win_mystery.htm

and, ask Sniper if he ever got the reamer, will save you some trouble and cost:

http://www.texasboars.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=22675&sid=2b768932ebf18aa8210dec02478b6cca

Ron Brown · Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 2:06 am Post subject:

Thanks Dave,

As usual you are a wealth of information on AR style rifles.

Barrel can be $150 and up
Barrel Extension - ~$40
Upper Receiver ~$160
Bolt and carrier ~$200
Gas Block ~$40
Labor ~ $140

So ... close to $750 before a handguard and reamer rental. Still, not bad for a new thumper upper.

An 18" .358 Win should pump out 200 gr bullets at close to 2400 fps. Hornady has a 180 gr 'single shot pistol bullet' that is spire point and probably will work. I think I have a box for my bolt gun. I do know I have a few Nosler partition bullets and lots of other projectile choices.

Using Barnes bullets one can sure burn through a C note quickly.

Ron
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David K · Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2012 3:39 am Post subject:

will definitely be a thumper Ron, will be exciting to see how it turns out

Ron Brown · Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 1:39 am Post subject:

It started .....

Ordered a barrel extension ....

DSA just sent a notice the .300 Blackout upper I ordered just shipped. When I ordered a bolt and carrier from Red X Arms, a barrel extension slipped in the cart.

Anyone have any opinions on Green Mountain barrels? - I'd thinking of a stainless in .358, 14:1 twist.

Ron
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David K · Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2012 2:32 am Post subject:

Green Mountain does makes some good barrels from what I have read about them

Ron Brown · Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 2:54 am Post subject:

The insanity continues .....

I bought a bolt today. I am sure I overpaid a bit but they are in short supply.

Next will be ordering a barrel, determining the lightest profile I should use (do I want 16 or 18" barrel length?) and then rounding up the reamers and such to do the project. I'll probably buy a set of headspace gauges as I have several rifles in the .308 family and they all use the same gauges.

I guess while the barrel is off to the mechanic, I'll need to get an upper receiver, handguard, flash hider and the rest of the goodies needed to complete the build. My lower already has a CMMG two-stage trigger. I'll need a buttstock. I have an M4 style tube, spring and buffer. I also have an A2 style stock but would need a buffer tube, spring and buffer.

Indecision .... may or may not be my problem.

Ron
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David K · Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 5:41 pm Post subject:

good luck, looking forward to a report when you get it all done

Ron Brown · Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 10:36 pm Post subject:

David K · Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 2:16 am Post subject:

AR Performance has lightweight .308 barrels, you can look at their profile, now these are extremely lightweight, in order to build a light, around 7 pound .308

http://www.ar15performance.com/308_barrel

don't know that I would go quite that light of a profile, but people were wanted a lightweight .308 so he had the barrel made for it

Ron Brown · Posted: Tue May 22, 2012 2:48 am Post subject:

Ron Brown · Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 2:25 am Post subject:

Midway had an LR 308 Upper in stock. It is now here. Came with a charging handle.

I also got a buffer tube, .750 Gas Block, carbine length gas tube and some other miscellaneous parts that had been on order from DMPS for several months.

Now starts a longer wait until the barrel is made. I was told it is 'in production' and should be available in less than 30 days.

I'll spent the time rounding up reamer, I've decided to buy one, headspace gauges and a few other parts I will need to complete the build.

Maybe by late summer I will complete this build.

Then, I can build another AR style rifle ....

Ron
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David K · Posted: Thu May 31, 2012 5:41 pm Post subject:

good deal Ron, looking forward to your efforts, might be something i'd be interested in

Ron Brown · Posted: Fri Jun 22, 2012 2:10 am Post subject:

Building this rifle has been interesting. I have 'notification' for email when parts become available. I was able to get the 'bolt completion' parts ordered this week.

Still waiting on a barrel. I have decoded to purchase a chamber reamer when I need it as several friends have shown interest in .358s after reading about the cartridge. I'm guessing .308 family headspace gauges won't be a problem.

My barrel was to be ready "Within 30 days" according to a May 21st email. But, then again, I'm still waiting on a barrel I ordered mid February. I think it will get here in on a day of the week that has a "y" in it.

Ron
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Ron Brown · Posted: Sun Dec 16, 2012 9:59 pm Post subject:

FINALLY! Well, almost finally. I still lack a bolt carrier. I've got one on order, a well as a complete bolt group, from Midway. The carrier group was to be here last week, then this week .... now mid February.

I tool the bolt carrier from my LR308 and may be able to test it this week. Gas port is drilled 0.063. It may need to be opened. The rifle weighs just under 8 pounds w/o optics. I used a Troy forearm and carbine length gas system. I have one of the Paladin Machine adjustable gas valves and may try it to get the thing to run with a 'plinking load' and pistol bullets.

Thomas Pola of Paladin machine did a great and quick job on the barrel.

I'll need to forage through my optics to see if I have a suitable scope ....

Ron
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David K · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 12:28 am Post subject:

its about time lol, looking forward to the reports...and pictures!

g ray · Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:29 am Post subject:

Yes ,for sure let us peek, 358 has been a fovorit of mine a number of years

David K · Posted: Wed Mar 13, 2013 3:06 pm Post subject:

i was looking for this thread to see how the 358 was coming along...Ron?
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Ron Brown · Posted: Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:38 pm Post subject:

UPDATE ....

After I got the rifle together, I ended drilling the port out to a #43 size drill. It ran perfectly. I mounted a 2 X 7 Leupold Light weight scope. The third shot had the scope 'close enough' and as the wind was at about 25 mph, all I did was break rocks and bounce cans at about 100 yards.

I haven't been back out to shoot it since. I did get a bolt carrier and a complete bolt group in (both this week ... with 2 sets of shipping charges). That means I can finish the light weight LR308 upper I have parts for too; AP Performance barrel, Light weight forearm, low profile gas block and such.

As soon as I get the chance to sit down 'on the bench', I will and report back as to accuracy. I suspect like all of the .308 family, it will shoot better than I can!

Ron

edit time of bolt carrier arrival
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David K · Posted: Sat Apr 13, 2013 6:47 pm Post subject:

sounds good Ron, post up some pics when you get a chance
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