TEXASBOARS.COM

[TexasBoars]

My gosh man,, if that aint accurate enough to kill a hog,, it aint goig to die
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KEVIN RYER
OWNER TEXASBOARS and TEXASBOARS FEEDERLIGHTS.
WORK ALL DAY HUNT ALL NIGHT (TM)

[TexasBoars]

Here's a Barnes recovered.






It is important to keep in mind, this bullet took out the bone in the first shoulder along with the in the second shoulder and held 99.999999999% (joking I can't weigh it that accurately) of its weight before it came to rest in the shield on the opposite side.

JUST A FOLLOW UP NOTE
AFter reviewing the video (which I haven't done till now on a big screen) the bullet was actually recovered from the second of two hogs the bullet struck (two in one shot),, I now understand why or how the bullet didn't passthrough and allowed us to recover it. It had already passed through 150 pound hog then DRT the second

I'll try to get'em posted soon.
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KEVIN RYER
OWNER TEXASBOARS and TEXASBOARS FEEDERLIGHTS.
WORK ALL DAY HUNT ALL NIGHT (TM)

[edro20]

A recovered Barnes is a rare thing. Good to know that they are working as advertised.
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[TexasBoars]

OK, here is the deal with that recovered Barnes Bullet from the 7 Mag.
that was actually a DOUBLE KILL
After reviewing the video on the large screen TV in High Quality it is clear my attempt at the 2fer was a success
So that bullet took out two 150 pound hogs
the SECOND HOG, the hog we recovered, was DRT The first hog was hit a bit far back I guess?
The video of this hunt, which includes multiple kills, and some awesomne video can be viewed at the following thread
http://www.texasboars.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=17772

Here's an additoinal video of a hunt at the same exact spot 5 days later.
the hog in this video didn't appear to be all that big,, till we shot it
It was 42 inches in circumfrance and according to the Weight Equation it was about 200 to 220 pounds and the age was about 5 or 6 years old.
the kill was not made on video, the hog walked right by the truck and the BACK UP SHOOTER (Chase) shot it with the 45-70 -- 330 Grn Barnes Banded Solid at about 125 yards. It was DRT

http://www.texasboars.com/wmv/hwy19t.wmv

I'll be gettin more video, we got lots of hogs now
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KEVIN RYER
OWNER TEXASBOARS and TEXASBOARS FEEDERLIGHTS.
WORK ALL DAY HUNT ALL NIGHT (TM)

[Spencer Barron]

I sure am glad you figured out that 2fer. When I saw a recovered TSX from a 7 mag on a 150# piggy I thought, "My little 'ol .308 doesn't stand a chance gettin' all the way through." But after I read the whole thing and saw the video I thought, "YEAH! That's what I want to see!"

That's great Research.

My next project is to work up a load for my XP-100. It has a 15 inch barrel chambered also in .308Win. I'm currently using 150 gr. Sierra's at 2600fps. I'll see what I can get with the 150 gr TSX and the Varget. This pistol has many, many sub 1/2" groups under it's belt...Along with quite a few deer and pigs.

Here's an old pic from several critters ago.

[Spencer Barron]

I have to tell you....That was pretty simple.
I started by backing off my normal charge of Varget by 1/2 grain and the velocity was about 10fps faster than my normal Sierra bullet load. The first group was 1 1/4 inches with .050 clearance between the bullet and lands. With the second load I used the same powder charge and seated the bullet .040 off the lands.
1st group noted with a single slash mark.
2nd group noted with double slash marks.
I'll go back tomorrow or Friday and see if it holds up.
XP-100
15 inch barrel
150 gr. TSX
2610fps
100 yards

[edro20]

Spencer, looks like you have another winner! Now for the dead pig photos!!
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[ccoker]

Speaking of Barnes....

crossposted from the 68 forums

there's been a push to get a 95g TTSX from Barnes for the 6.8

he Barnes lab manager, Thad was at Bill Wilson’s ranch over the weekend along with “HTR” doing some testing of the much anticipated new bullet from Barnes.
We have been clamoring for this for some time and think it’s going THE bullet for 6.8
I am a huge Barnes fan and I have yet to pull the trigger releasing a Barnes projectile and lose an animal.
They go down hard and fast.

They wacked 11 pigs and were doing more testing, getting complete pass through penetration thorough both shoulders at 325 yards on a 190lb hog. get this, out of an 11″ SBR!!

I have some coming this week and will be loading and testing
If all works out right, a buddy is going Axis deer hunting next weekend and he will borrow my Wilson Combat 6.8 Recon.
That would be very cool if he were to get one.

Bill emailed these to me over the weekend and wanted me to post the pix up as he's driving back to work...














I know HTR has some and I have some enroute
we will both be posting groups

HTR has several different barrels and I have 2, I am going to do some testing on a few other locals guns

That should be a pretty good cross sampling and we will be providing feedback to Barnes

Also, Bill told me he was getting expansion and penetration on a 190lb pig, both shoulders at 325 yards today...
and get this, out of an 11" SBR with a MV of 2600 FPS

wicked cool
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[460XVR]

[Spencer Barron]

460XVR,

Thanks for the info.
I had considered the 165 or 168 gr TSX for my .308 Rifle but I finally settled on the 150 gr TSX with the logic being that if the bullet holds together it would do exactly what a 165 conventional bullet would do, maybe even better.

As to my XP, frankly, I just don't want any more recoil. I have shot it with 165 gr Sierras and could really feel the difference or thought I could .

Of course I could just be a Big Sissy...

I don't remember exactly which guy it was...Robert Rourk or Pondoro Taylor...But one of them used to say, "Recoil never killed anyone." He may be right...But that doesn't make it fun...Not for me anyway.


I have been considering the 168TSX for my /06 though. Maybe later.

Spencer

[Kiley Horak]

Hey guys this is my first post so please go easy on me. Been hunting hogs for several years now and have been thinking of starting to reload. Been using the .308 and .300wsm for hunting the blinds under Kevin's feeder light.
I love that thing. 180 federal fusions have been my ammo of choice but now I have been wanting to try the Barnes TSX. But not for $46 a box. I shoot quite a bit so reloading this is my only option. Problem is I have never have reloaded. Was considering the lee hand press to start out with. Looking to use the 168 Tsx. Any tips would be great as to powders brass and load data would be great.

Thanks, kh

[edro20]

The factory loaded Barnes are very expensive (that's what started me hand loading). I started with Lee equipment and still use it. The day may come when I upgrade, but not yet. Not sure if you mentioned the Lee thing that you smack with a mallet to load rounds. I'd avoid that and get a single stage press (you DID say press, but I am just making sure). Lee makes decent stuff, but it is low end. That said, you can develop respectable hunting rounds using Lee equipment.

Good place to start looking for all things reloading:
http://www.midwayusa.com/

There is a ton more, but you should begin at the beginning. Get a book and start reading. Ask questions here. There are a ton of folks that have more experience than I do. "Burt" is a good source for advice on these things. BTW, I'd suggest the 150 grain for the TSX in .308 Win. Good Luck.
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[s10goes10s]

I beleive this is the cheapest press kit you will find
unless it's a used freind deal
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/product/standard-item.jsp?_DARGS=/cabelas/en/common/catalog/item-link.jsp_A&_DAV=MainCatcat602007-cat20728-cat20847&id=0053986216575a&navCount=4&podId=0053986&parentId=cat20847&masterpathid=&navAction=push&catalogCode=IA&rid=&parentType=index&indexId=cat20847&hasJS=true
sorry its so dang long

[Kiley Horak]

Thanks for the reply. Yea it is the hand held press not the hammer classic. Cabela's has them on the website. Really don't need to load a ton of rounds at a time. Just want to try keep up with what I am shooting. Do not have a dedicated spot for a press at this time and want to get my feet wet before I decide to pursue it further. Have had good luck with the Federal 180's. Did not have the smack down with the 150gr. Winchester XP3's. All this talk about the tsx has gotten me fired up. Just looking for a good load in the .308 with the Tsx that I can load myself. I do use 45/70 and a .44mag on different types of hog hunts and might want to explore those reloading options in the future as well. I know each gun is different but I don't like wasting a lot of time shooting tiny groups at paper. 1 to 2 in. groups at a 100 would be good enough for my needs. Most of those night shots are inside a 100yards and many are at 75 or less. My hog guns are pretty much dedicated for certain venues. I would be loading for two different .308's so I am going to take a guess that I need to do a full resize each time. Always used the heavier bullet for caliber if it was available. Do the 150 tsx perform better than the 168's?

[Burt]

TSX bulllets penetrate more than conventional bullets of a higher weight.
The .30 caliber 130 grain TSX will take out up to around 300 pounders
with shoulder hits no problem, based on what I have seen so far.
s10 has killed a good 50 pigs using the 130 grain in a .30-06 as an example.

48.0 grains of Varget and that 130 grain TSX is what I'm using in the wife's
.308 Winchester. The load is barely above the starting load, but works well.

Yes, full length resizing is needed when using the ammo in more than one gun.

Hopefully you have been saving your fired brass.
If not, you have been throwing money away.
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Ban guns to eliminate crime ?
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[Kiley Horak]

Thanks again. Been reading the ABC"S of reloading and trying to learn more about it. Any primer preference or is it take what I can get my hands on? Do have some brass scattered around. Is the Fusion brass ok or should I spring for new brass? Does new brass need to be sized and/ or trimmed or just load it and go? I do want to be consistent in whatever it is I am doing. Shot a large boar last Sat. night in the shoulder with a cheap Winchester 180 p.p. and he was DRT. Obviously there was no pass thru, but that bullet worked that time for that shot. Been dying to get a pass thru on one of those big ones. That is what lead me here. Thank you for all of your help. I will do some more research and let you boys know what I come up with. Hopefully, I will be able to ask more questions here. Do not know much about forums (read but do not post) but I sure would like to share some dead hog pictures with yall.(do not know how) Once I bought that light from Kevin I became Man on Fire. For me, hog hunting is an addiction that there is no cure for. Glad I finally posted.

kh

[Burt]

The 180 grain bullet is a little more heavy for caliber, and because of that you
have a better chance of good penetration. ( Compared to a 150 grain Power Point
for example. )

Load data always shows what primer the outfit used when working up the loads.
The current situation may not allow the luxury of obtaining certain brands
though. Using another brand will work. As always though, start with the lightest
load listed and work up slowly. Often, a load somewhat less than max will shoot
the best also.
The brass you have will be ok, unless you just want to use some other brand.
Here again - might be some brands you can't get right now too.
New brass should be sized, as often times the case mouths have been
dented slightly by handling / packaging.
The only exception to this is Nosler Custom Brass. Spendy, but weighed, sized, trimmed,
etc. The only stuff you can prime and load right out of the box as far as I'm concerned.
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Ban guns to eliminate crime ?
Let's ban cars, to eliminate drunk driving.
Makes as much sense.

[edro20]

Get Imperial Sizing Wax!!! Nevermind everthing else!! Get it, use it and forget the rest. Use in very tiny amounts. No other-- get the Imperial Sizing Wax. I'm crashing, but I wanted to save you a headache down the road first.
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[Kiley Horak]

One last ? for tonight. Have decided on the Lee hand press. Looking at the Lee dies at Cabelas. Do I need to get the separate crimp die? I know I need the full length resize die. Both of those die sets seem to be missing one die or the other for my needs. Do not mind doing the extra step if I need to get a good crimp. calipers, good scale, case trimmer or other must have items? Trying to get my list together. Apologize for all the questions but I have no one else to ask that has the knowledge.

kh

[Burt]

Most bullet seating dies have a crimping function built in.
It is possible to seat and crimp all at one time.
But, it is best to seat bullets first, then crimp in a separate operation.
Most rifle bullets loaded in bottle necked rounds have no crimp groove,
and they usually don't really need to be crimped.
Ammo for lever action rifles is a different story - but bullets designed for
those have crimp grooves.

Now, the crimp style normally seen in those dies is a roll crimp.
This style of crimp needs a crimp groove ( aka cannalure ) on a bullet in
order to use the feature. However, Lee makes a factory crimp die that does
not depend on this feature. In fact, Barnes suggests using a factory crimp
style on the 130 grain .30 caliber TSX bullet.

You have listed most of the major stuff you'll need.
Don't forget loading blocks also. Helps to have something to put the
cases in when you are loading them.
Case mouth deburring tool, there's another item.
_________________
Ban guns to eliminate crime ?
Let's ban cars, to eliminate drunk driving.
Makes as much sense.

[Spencer Barron]

Well, the results are in and I couldn't have hoped for a better test. The shot was with my new .308 Win loads using the 150 gr. TSX. The distance was 140 steps and that's probably 130 or so yards. I went for the shoulder and the bullet is somewhere in Never-Never Land as it was a complete pass thru. You can see the blood splatter on the ground in the second picture.

Did I mention that he was DRT?

I'm a very happy camper.

Spencer

[edro20]

Woo hoo! the Barnes TSX strikes again! Great job, Spencer
That blood spatter really tells the tale!
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[Burt]

Congrats !
No surprise here.
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Ban guns to eliminate crime ?
Let's ban cars, to eliminate drunk driving.
Makes as much sense.

[TexasBoars]

NO, BARNES DID NOT SPONSOR this in ANY WAY SHAPE FORM OR FASHON

This is my EXPERIENCE, allow me to share it with you.
You can call call this a "TEST" or you can call it a "SLAUGHTER". You can call me CRUEL, here's what I now say, if a hog can read, it better pick a bible and pray for mercy, becuase, NOW DAYS, mercy is not what I serve.

Since starting this thread, and testing the BARNES BULLETS, I have gone a long ways
I don't post my stuff too often because I know members get tired of people "BOSTING" of their kills and some may not even approve of it any longer.. SO, I perty much leave it all off, unless it's really impressive story.

Here in VAN ZANDT COUNTY I have had to declare all out war WAR against feral hogs. It is now a WAR ZONE --- I drove by a watermelon field the other day in which I was called on for hog removal, the patch was covered in buzzards (100's) and the smell of dead hogs was almost overwhelming while driving past the field! My best estimate is around 15 hogs in 3 nights. The owner says they were taking out well over 300 melons a night, @ $5.00 a melon for over a week! This just one incident that plays out night after night after night around here.

I believe VAN ZANDT was listed in the TOP 5 WORST COUNTIES and from what I see it is well deserved Reports of pet dogs being killed, PREDATION from hogs that include eating calves as they drop (bones and all) - hogs hitting watermelon fields and taking out over $1,000.00 worth a night and I have lots worse stories.

Anyway, in this war BARNES BULLETS have turned out to be the the golden loads and are without question, the "GO TO LOADS" now!
The testing is basically over Barnes are the the bullets I/we now rely on and they do not/have not let us down. I now hunt an average of 4 to 5 nights a week, with multiple kills occuring regularly.
Point being, it aint to brag, its too let you know, it, the test, was THOROUGH

This summer was my summer of BEASTS. MULTIPLE 300 and 400 pound bruisers. In one month, I nicknamed it my "MONTH OF MONSTERS", I killed 5 big boar over 300 pounds and one of them likely exceeded 400 pounds. I have absolutely no doubts when I come up against these bruisers the BARNES bullets will take out both shoulders and send'em to the ground.
The vast majority of my shots are DRT (dead right there).
AND AGAIN, NO, I was not paid, BARNES in no way sponsored this!
That's my humble experience
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KEVIN RYER
OWNER TEXASBOARS and TEXASBOARS FEEDERLIGHTS.
WORK ALL DAY HUNT ALL NIGHT (TM)

[Burt]

And once again I say < drum roll > I told you so.
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Ban guns to eliminate crime ?
Let's ban cars, to eliminate drunk driving.
Makes as much sense.

[TexasBoars]

One more thing, the MAIN REASON we started this thread/blog was due to the odd fact that the BARNES were so FINICKY. Super accurate in one gun and wouldn't print on 11 inch target with another gun using same load.
We wanted to find the SECRET or REASON behind this phenomenon.

SOLID COPPER is a COMPLETE DIFFERENT experience from conventional led jacketed bullets!! It requires a change of TACTICS associated with led core bullets. IT IS A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT ANIMAL. Like comparing a WWI fixed wing prop bi-plane to a modern day jet fighter! With led core it takes a heavier slower bullet to hold together and get deep penetration,, with the SOLID COPPER it allows you to go somewhat lighter and WHOLE LOT faster, which bumps up the FT POUNDS, flatter trajectory, and unbelievable penetration with a dramatic increase in the wound channel.

THE BASIC SYNOPSIS is this;
There were two MAIN CULPRITS in 99% of the cases of poor accuracy.
#1 Using a bullet weight that was too heavy for the standard twist rate. (due to the lighter weight of copper you have to with a lighter weight bullet so the bullet length doesn't affect stability).
#2 SEATING DEPTH plays an ENORMOUS PART in getting your loads down to acceptable accuracy. In nearly all cases we were able to get accuracy to 1 MOA or better. Achieving virtually unfailing 2.0 MOA or under (for standard big game calibers) was rather simple once we figured out the protocol.

USING THE INFORMATION SUPPLIED IN THIS THREAD will provide just about any handloader with the SECRET PROTOCOL to load these bullets with deadly accuracy. Therefore it is no longer a "GAMBLE" to buying a box of high dollar bullets.
MAKE SURE you pick a "BULLET WEIGHT" that is not too heavy for STANDARD TWIST RATES. Make sure the bullets are not specifically labeled for "FASTER TWIST RATES" on the box)!!!!!
If the bullets shoot erratically (downright TERRIBLE -- DO NOT PANIC!) SIMPLY FOLLOW THE DIRECTIONS FOR ZEROING IN ON THE SEATING DEPTH that suits your specific gun. Seating depth alone can make for groups that range for 12 to 15 inches to subzero using the same powder and same primer SO DO NOT PANIC when your first loads won't even stay on the paper MOST of the time first loads will print very well if you follow the OAL set by BARNES LOADING DATA!

USE ONLY THE LOAD DATA PROVIDED BY BARNES AND PAY ATTENTION TO THE OVER-ALL-CARTRIDGE-LENGTH provided by Barnes. DO NOT USE seating depths you found desirable with CONVENTIONAL LED CORE bullets

Its VERY BASIC once the technique is put to practice.
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KEVIN RYER
OWNER TEXASBOARS and TEXASBOARS FEEDERLIGHTS.
WORK ALL DAY HUNT ALL NIGHT (TM)

[edro20]

It seems to me that much of the confusion regarding twist rate is that bullet length is what is most important when choosing the correct bullet. As Kevin pointed out copper is less dense then lead so a Barnes bullet will be slightly longer than the same weight lead bullet. Longer bullets require a faster twist rate. In other words a 150 grain traditional bullet might stabilize fine in your rifle, but a 150 grain Barnes bullet might not because it is slightly longer. This is confusing since lots of folks consider bullet weight when considering twist rate. Barnes does recommend dropping down bullet weight when switching to their products.
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[TexasBoars]

[quote="edro20"]It seems to me that much of the confusion regarding twist rate is that bullet length is what is most important when choosing the correct bullet. [quote]

Yeah, we're really trying to make one point very clear.
When it comes to bullets like the BARNES TSX or even SOLID BRASS you're comparison should LENGTH to LENGTH and not WEIGHT to WEIGHT.
In other words, taking the 308, a 160 grain solid copper or solid brass will be about the same length as 180 or 190 grain cup and core. If you move up to an equal weight of 180 grain copper or brass bullet it will be much longer than its cup and core counter-part (traditional jacketed bullet) and will require a faster twist rate to stabalize it.
This is where much of the confusion is generated. Traditional LOGIC is that: lighter rounds loose penetration capability. This LOGICAL COMPARISON is defeated due to the fact the the solid copper or brass bullets will hold together under much higher hydraulic pressures (the stress of striking tissue and bone). So even though it doesn't sound logical, the fact is,, they will provide much greater penetration even though they're lighter.
_________________
KEVIN RYER
OWNER TEXASBOARS and TEXASBOARS FEEDERLIGHTS.
WORK ALL DAY HUNT ALL NIGHT (TM)

[TexasBoars]

BLOG UPDATE

Well, I've been using BArnes TSX now ever since this thread started.
I have well over 100 kills using the BARNES TTSX as well as the BARNES BANDID SOLID.
My traditional LOGIC has been SMASHED and BURNED.
For me -- Bullet performance has been given a whole new definition. Especially with the BANDID SOLIDS.
Without going into a bunch of mumbo jumbo trying to prove my results I'm just going to say it as it is.
These rounds are simply SUPERIOR to cup and core in virtually every aspect when it comes to taking down hogs,, including the BIG BOYS.
Its clear to me, after well over 100 kills with some out to 400+ yards), they are consistently more accurate and produce faster kills and better blood trails than traditional cup and core (jacketed bullets). HANDS DOWN.
This is in no way a CRITCISM to anybody who chooses to use traditional jacketed bullets (with common sense).
We also know that its not only BARNES making these types of rounds now days. We can now include several other rounds in the line up. I don't them right off hand but I know BURT can list them for us.

Many of you will notice I also listed the BARNES BANDID SOLIDS! I had some real hesitation, as well as LITTLE CONFIDENCE, using these NON-EXPANDING solid rounds due to the traditional thought that NON-EXPANDING bullets simply won't unleash enough energy or create quality wound channels. BULL CRAP! Thats GARBAGE! In the calibers I use which includes the 243, 7 Mag, 300 Win Mag, and the 45-70 the BANDID SOLIDS produced good blood trails and quick kills as well as MANY double kills. In the 45-70 I even a TRIPLE KILL on 3 mature sow. IN FACT the largest exit wounds ihave ever seen in my life were produced from the BARNES BANDID SOLIDS after they struck solid hard bone structures -- exit wounds the size of a soft balls
BARNES BANDID SOLIDS may not be for everyone, but make no mistake, they are indead extremely lethal at high velocities.
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KEVIN RYER
OWNER TEXASBOARS and TEXASBOARS FEEDERLIGHTS.
WORK ALL DAY HUNT ALL NIGHT (TM)

[hogcaller]

Hornady GMX is an unleaded option that comes to mind. I have yet to use it though, but price wise it is very similar to Barnes. I have used the Barnes TSX in 210 gr .338 cal in 338-06.........busted right through a 225 lb sow that was caked in mud at 175 yards or so. I was very impressed.........just wish the unleaded bullets (of any manufacturer) were cheaper to shoot!